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Dear Emigre, Tag, you are Dead!

And, at least, according to Elliot Earls, it is our fault. “Emigre magazine is dead,” he writes in his contribution to the final collection of Letters to the Editor in Emigre’s tombstone (or issue 69), “and the blogs have killed you.”

Much of the writing in Emigre does not simply poke, it probes, hard, until it bleeds and then pours vinegar on the wound. Mr. Earls pontificates further, “The discourse was stolen not by a few visionaries with commitment and courage, but by the great leveling wheels of the internet.” His autopsy further reveals that “Emigre magazine suffered a sort of ‘death by a thousand cuts (blogs),’ and for this I’m deeply saddened. More power,” signed, Elliot Earls.

The biggest question now that Emigre magazine has been officially pronounced dead is What’s Next? “What or who,” asks Andrew Blauvelt “will occupy the place that Emigre leaves?” Katherine McCoy hints, not optimistically, at blogs, “Perhaps blogs are filling Emigre’s role as places for alternative voices. But their long-term contribution remains to be seen, since they are missing key elements of Emigre.” Upon reading I wonder what those key elements are. “At this point,” McCoy writes “blog writing is a fairly ephemeral form of publishing, preserved only as long as someone maintains the server.” Suddenly, an anthology — or putting a down payment for our own server — does not sound like a bad idea. McCoy is also wary about the lack of a traditional editor, specially the lack of an editor as astute as Rudy VanderLans, “While many celebrate the spontaneity and grassroots democracy of blog dialogues, the vision of an enlightened editor is a rare things — and a great publishing tradition.” Michael Dooley also expresses a tinge of disappointment, “Since the dust has settled, everyone now engages in relatively mundane blog chats about branding and such.”

In his review of Emigre 69, and own good-bye, Rick Poynor leaves his initial foray into blogs with this: “Design blogs generate a lot of noise and they sure do love their own hype, but nothing produced in this area has so far equaled the concentrated documentary achievement and design culture transforming impact of Emigre and if you doubt this, just go and look at the magazine. Emigre had a clearly defined purpose.”

One thing is clear: Emigre = Good, Blogs = Bad. What is not explicitly clear, and something I find a tad incongruent with Emigre’s finger-pointing tradition, is that everyone simply addresses the problem as “blogs”. Now, I may sound self-absorbed (or delusional) in the second half of this paragraph and from hereon, but there are only two major design blogs that could potentially fit in this design discourse doomsday equation: Speak Up and Design Observer. I doubt that Poynor would call his fellow Founding Writers lovers of their own hype; I also don’t think Earls would call anyone on Design Observer a coward or uncommitted; and since we outnumber Design Observer in “mundane blog chats about branding” I’m positive Dooley is referring to Speak Up. So, guess what? The shoe fits. We killed Emigre.

Nonsense.

Emigre died of natural causes. If anything, Speak Up provided an amplifier in their last days. Steve Heller — whose “Cult of the Ugly” ghosts may finally be put to sleep after being woken one last time with a bucket of cold water in this final number — in his Dear Emigre warns Rudy about what the reaction would have been to his article, “…had there been a blogosphere back then just imagine what the volume of posts would be like.” With issue 64, Rant, Emigre turned to its final iteration as a pocketbook. After being distributed, free of charge, to over 35,000 people, only 2,000 people subscribed with the release of Rant and a $28 subscription. I assume, only a fraction read it. On May of 2004, former Speak Up author, Sam Potts (who two issues later wrote a piece for Emigre) led an inquisitive discussion on the writing that appeared on Rant. This is what Heller warned Rudy about. The discussion is perhaps one of my all-time favorites and I can’t help but feel that it generated much needed buzz in Emigre’s final days. Allow me one final bout of self-absorption: Speak Up was somehow mentioned or included in the last five numbers of Emigre. We were at their bedside. Earls might think we were putting poison in their IV.

In the sixty-seventh short story by Rudy VanderLans, he writes about Speak Up, “It’s difficult to compete against daily short opinion pieces and the instant replies in which logo redesigns of large corporations receive the most attention. The fury reminds me of the heyday of Emigre, except we occasionally challenged the status quo, while the Speak Up crowd wants to maintain it as best as they can.” Poynor, again talking of “blogs”, adds “No one, so far, has used the medium to stake out an urgent critical position comparable to Keedy’s or Blauvelt’s in the pages of Emigre in the 1990s. Nor have blogs proved to be the medium for exploring new design aesthetics.”

Somehow it has become implied that blogs should indeed fill the void left by Emigre and surely Speak Up is not stepping up to the task by not exploring new design aesthetics, by not challenging the status quo, by not being an actual printed thing that can be championed in a bookshelf and, above all, by being unedited — although I could potentially take offense at that. Well, here is where the shoe drops: Speak Up is not, nor it wants to be Emigre. Especially not with all these deficiencies — and how could we even be charged of killing Emigre if, in the eye of the beholder, we are not armed with nary a stone against its Goliath-sized contribution to design history?

Again, nonsense.

Emigre was born in a time when all the above qualities were desperately needed. When design needed to veer off topic and off road and it needed a rugged vehicle for the stodgy road ahead. In those days, apparently, New York was a scary place where design decisions were made on behalf of the nation and the profession. New York has changed, and so has the world and our profession. Design has been let loose, in California, in Seattle, Austin, Tijuana. Design aesthetics have been discovered, copied and swallowed by mainstream. Design has become more than ever — to the hefty annoyance of many of Emigre’s contributors and editor — commerce’s peanut butter to its sweet, sticky jelly. That is why branding discussions ignite readers so much. This is what design is now and what schools, publications and the marketplace have molded it into. For every designer concerned with theory, linguistics, the environment, activism, there are over a dozen designers ready to rebrand AT&T. The best that Speak Up has to offer — and its mission — is to provide a forum where the realities of the working designer in the professional world can be met face forward. And through this discussion, hopefully, designers can be better prepared to do their job. This is something that Emigre can’t — and I bet doesn’t want to — provide today. So, yeah, “blogs” can’t do what Emigre did. Because we live in a different time. The old guard which Emigre so dutifully confronted are not the enemies of the younger generation. We are a breed of Emigre’s revolutionary aesthetics and sensibilities crossed with awe and respect for the tradition and the work of the people that forged this profession as we know it. We have little to rebel against because, despite our constant complaints, we have it good. We know where our profession is headed and we know it in part thanks to Emigre. Early on Rudy may have mentioned to me (or in one of his intros) that Speak Up is not challenging the status quo, and I have to admit that every day I wonder how I can challenge this quo full of status. The thing is, I personally don’t have any beef with it, and five years into the two thousands I have yet to find anyone in our field challenging it. Not even Emigre. It had the ammunition but no real target after Rant.

So, thank you, but we will pass on handling that torch in need of some handing down. It seems more of a burden than an honor.

I wish it were blogs that killed Emigre, then we wouldn’t have to face the fact that Emigre may not be needed anymore in this uneventful profession in which we practice today. While reading Emigre 69, I longed for having been born a few decades earlier and to have been part of what seem like tumultuous and good times in graphic design where opinions mattered and actually shaped the profession. Nonetheless, this — this moment, this blog, this discussion, this imminent redesign of the AT&T logo — is the reality we live in and I’m glad as hell to be part of it and see what becomes of it in all its unedited and server-dependent behavior.

Dear Emigre,

Thank you.

And sorry for that death stuff.

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ENTRY DETAILS
ARCHIVE ID 2475 FILED UNDER Critique
PUBLISHED ON Nov.17.2005 BY Armin
WITH COMMENTS
Comments
superkhy’s comment is:

i do have to agree that blogs are a tad overhyped, though i still frequent several dozens of them on a daily basis for random, and mostly trivial, information.

Emigre will be missed. it was, in my opinion, the best published source for critical writings on design. the smartest and most diverse in subject.

it still blows my mind that it (presumbly) is over. what the hell am i suppose to read now??? (aside from Speak Up of course)

On Nov.17.2005 at 01:34 AM
Ravenone’s comment is:

I only saw Emigre in print once, last year, an issue tucked into the back of the art shelf in B&N (I believe)...but I've heard of it from blogs like this, and was curious about it.

As for SpeakUp causing the death of something... while not saying it's impossible, I'll say it's unlikely and no in the spirit of Speak Up. Ever since I started coming here, I've noticed it's a place of learning and ideas and opinions, and ... a bit more playful than I was lead to believe the design-side of the art spectrum was from my few college classes. Watching, reading this blog I find myself learning, learning, learning. Exposed to so many ideas that are just plain new to me, or new veiws on old ideas.

Because of SpeakUp's instantaneous responses, the speed of it all, I feel more connected to design profesionals I would never have a chance to even glance at in my daily life. I don't have to wait for a book to be published to have a question answered, to know that other people might be having the same Ideas I'm having.

Nothing lasts forever. While the popularity of Blogs may play some part of the death of Emigre, the changing times were probably just as likely to be the culprits who dealt the death-blow.

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:17 AM
Tan’s comment is:

"So David conquered the Philistine giant with a sling and a stone."

All good things do indeed must come to an end. But it's with certainty that Speak Up will also one day meet the same fate, because as the saying goes, "The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long."

It's truly sad to see Emigre end, as it did to see Critique end a few years ago. I'm with Armin, I don't believe in this fabricated/Highlander-there-can-be-only-one scenario. There is always room for more voices and forms of discourse. If it had evolved, Emigre could have benefitted from the resurgence of design discourse spurred on by blogs, instead of playing martyr to them.

What's next?

Who cares? Just enjoy and participate in what's now.

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:52 AM
Christopher Cabanillas’s comment is:

This is the really funny thing, when it was announced that Emigre was indeed dead I did a doubletake as I had thought the magazine was already dead. I'm not trying to be ironic. I really thought Emigre had gone the way of the Dodo long before I'd heard of it.

Perhaps, what killed Emigre was… Emigre?

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:57 AM
m. kingsley’s comment is:

While I cherish my collection of Emigres, I truthfully can't say that I've ever gone back to reread an old issue.

While I cherish my participation in Speak Up and the ability to participate in the (don't call it a) community over at Design Observer, I have yet to go back and read posts from a couple years ago.

My dear fellow designers, Emigre was a great design magazine — as were Gebrausgraphik, Beach Culture and Flair — but let's hold back on the rending of garments and gnashing of teeth.

It was a thrill to open up the oversized mailer and read one of the first interviews with, say… David Carson. It was a thrill to get all worked up at Massimo Vignelli's old man-erisms and the whole "Cult of the Ugly" contretemps. But frankly, such huffery and puffery is the province of immaturity — with small factions drawing lines in the sand around their little design kingdoms.

Rudy VanderLans is a fine writer — possessing confidence of voice, of opinion and of self. The same could be said of Jeffery Keedy and Michael Bierut; and while I enjoy reading Heller, I actually prefer hearing him speak — he's quite good in front of people. Even so, this list of design writers can't hold a candle to the pleasure of reading something like Leo Steinberg's (here's a mp3 excerpt) masterwork The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion; in which he ponders the Christian soul through its visual history.

I was disappointed to read the usually elegant Rick Poyner's petulant disdain for design blogs in his elegy for Emigre. By attributing a "clearly defined purpose" for Emigre, he suggests that blogs are unfocused. And as Armin pointed out, he's probably not speaking of Design Observer. Fine. But tell me: what's "undefined" about initiating an open public dialog on design?

If it's such a bad thing to love your own hype; how do we resolve Tibor Kalman and David Carson?

If it's editorial "focus" you're looking for: what's so hard about only reading posts by authors which interest you? The internet does allow one to search.

If it's a "momentous or contentious" event: how about the never-before-seen accessibility to a whole host of previously unknown designers and ideas.

I used to enjoy reading the letters to Emigre because they had the same sense of inclusion that one finds on Speak Up. Only… they had limited space compared to the web. Yes, blogs are places for chatter; but they are also places of connection and sharing. If someone is willing to take a few minutes to write a reply or reprimand, that's a gift.

It is agreed: Emigre was running out of steam. Truth be told, how many of us actually watched the Elliot Peter Earls DVD? And how many of us were disappointed to receive the Emigre Legacy or Lost Formats Preservation Society issues (#56 & 57)?

So in response to the question of whether the blogs killed Emigre, I'd like to refer to a passage in the Steinberg lectures that I linked to earlier. He asks the question if someone tickles your nose with a feather, where is the tickle located?

If the blogs killed Emigre, where was the death located?

On Nov.17.2005 at 03:46 AM
Su’s comment is:

“At this point,” McCoy writes “blog writing is a fairly ephemeral form of publishing, preserved only as long as someone maintains the server.”

Y'know, I am so fucking tired of this asinine belief being trotted out over and over again. I seem to remember it coming up in some previous Emigre or discussion thereof, also(I think it was Lorraine Wild that time.) Let's switch a few words around, shall we?

"Wood pulp is a fairly ephemeral form of publishing, preserved only as long as someone keeps it away from fire, water, air, certain insects, and sunlight. And there are only so many copies. And it's expensive and slow to make more."

Don't get me wrong, though; I love my books. That hasn't kept me from amassing an 8+gig digital library. But I am also fully aware that pretty much all the things that could destroy my dead tree library(minus the insects, though plus a fungus) will do the same to the digital one. Except that duplicating it is easy, fast, and effectively cost-free.

Are these people truly completely unaware of how it's near-impossible to not have something you publish on the net be saved in perpetuity by multiple agencies and even in time-stamped versions, regardless of your wishes and without notice, unless you put everything behind a password or do a large amount of tracking down and letter-writing? That's not even counting packrats like me just spidering your entire site and saving a personal archive. Or, get this: printing out articles. It's been known to happen. Speak Up does not necessarily equal the server it's on anymore than a book equals the particular copy you are holding. Without even trying, I can name three potential external sources for the site. I'm tempted to become the fourth out of spite.

Poynor's assessment of blogs rang a bit strange to me, and I'm still waiting for a response to my question, though I don't particularly think I'll get one, to be honest. But I'm used to that.

As to the comfortable accusation that The Blogs Killed Emigre, Rudy was musing about that himself in Rant. Prophecy? Fulfilled. Well, that was easy.

I do find it a bit odd that Armin overlooked mentioning Poynor's suggestion that Emigre'd been circling the drain going on four years now, which is the single most damning comment I've seen so far. Wait, no. Actually, prior to Kingsley above, it was just plain the single damning thing. Almost nobody seems prepared to wonder if maybe Emigre had become irrelevant all on its own, rather than due to some blogger rabble uprising. If the blogs took attention away from the magazine, wouldn't it follow that people had been looking around for something else in the first place? But that's too simplistic. The actuality seems to be that they were reading both. Hm.

Is it just me, or does it seem like someone's looking for a scapegoat?

On Nov.17.2005 at 06:46 AM
Pesky Illustrator’s comment is:

Emigre didn't die. The magazine ceased publishing but the foundry, the ideas and the people who were a part of this astute, challenging design experiment are alive and kicking.

Say something new.

On Nov.17.2005 at 08:09 AM
Armin’s comment is:

Pesky, yes, Emigre, Inc. didn't die, Emigre the magazine did. I guess I should have clarified that.

> Say something new.

I'm sorry, is this old news already? Man, blogs can't even keep up with blogs anymore.

On Nov.17.2005 at 08:47 AM
Bryony’s comment is:

the last four years

That pretty much coincides with the latest reinvention — the smaller format, book style, etc. One last attempt. DNR (do not resuscitate) not yet signed.

For a while there it actually seemed to me like blogs and Emigre (among others) were collaborating, as we began to see people like Sam Potts and Jason A. Tselentis writing for both mediums. Ideas, quotes, names and situations were borrowed and distributed by both.

More than blogs killing Emigre (the magazine), or Emigre surrendering to the latest trend, a long life has come to and end due to the natural course of a well-lived lifespan.

On Nov.17.2005 at 09:29 AM
agrayspace’s comment is:

I would argue that the Open Source ideology that is the foundation of "blogs" is more an affront to the status quo than anything �migré has been able to achieve in the last 5 years.

Sure for the most part we are not quoting Derrida and pontificating on the place of french literary theory in contemporary design (is there one?) and the lack of a visionary editor results in varied output quality but honestly some of Rudy's experiments were not always glittery gold but plain old boring.

And I'll be damned if the very idea of the "design blog" isn't the most exciting and revolutionary thing to happen to the discourse in a while, and the fact that it does ignite such passion should never be derided. Turning up our noses are we?

We are becoming consumers of our own media production and that has the old guard of media producers scratching their head and saying "WTF"! After all advertising as we know it is dead.

Not to disrespect �migré, as it was incredibly influential in my growth as a designer. And I actually enjoyed the new Rant format immensely more than the Music focused claptrap and the last superfluous editions of the format previous to that.

Really good things are supposed to come to an end. And I am glad to see it go admirably.

On Nov.17.2005 at 09:33 AM
Rick’s comment is:

There you have it.

Emerging communication technologies and the free market system have conspired once again.

I'm not happy to see a good thing die, but evolve damn you, evolve!

On Nov.17.2005 at 09:45 AM
Darrel’s comment is:

yea, the internet changes things.

'course, this leads to the obvious question...why didn't Emigre Mag just move online?

On Nov.17.2005 at 09:53 AM
pk’s comment is:

i had a few conversations via email with vanderlans about design online; he seemed to be of the opinion that whatever was happening at that point wasn't even pertinent. not really surprised the publication never moved on line in light of his reactions. i'll dig up the emails and post.

On Nov.17.2005 at 10:12 AM
Andrew Twigg’s comment is:

It must have been exhausting. Sometimes things end because the forces behind them are done, not that other forces can't be factors in a decision to shutter a publication.

Whether Emirge is dead or not (call it whatever you want, suicide, murder, moving on, vanished!), we all knew it had to be coming when we weren't allowed to renew our subscriptions. As if it weren't hard enough to get it already (who knew when it would arrive in the mail anyway?) now we had to wait for it to arrive at the local bookstore or get it from Amazon.

Oh, and for what it's worth, Amazon says this issue isn't being released until next year.

On Nov.17.2005 at 10:58 AM
did video kill the radio star?’s comment is:

To me, Emigre will remain alive and well with many years of issues to look back on that are FULL of interviews which went way beyond the obvious. Emigre is literally (and in most cases the only forum) responsible for presenting an eclectic mix of designers, educators, musicians and design philosophies which blogs haven't even begun to touch in content. I have full confidence Emigre will mutate into something else maybe not for a while but that kind of passion doesn't DIE it recreates itself. Anyone can run a blog and anyone can print books but not everyone can fill those 2 with meaningful content and that’s what I’ll miss...content.

As for the Elliot Earls comment...he’s wrong blogs cant touch the legacy that is Emigre.

I’ve never once printed anything from a blog or wanted to read something 4 or 5 times for inspiration, or xeroxed blog content to give to students. There is content in Emigre that’s years old but still ahead it’s time...

So I say, until we meet again......

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:08 PM
marian bantjes’s comment is:

While I agree that it is somewhat absurd to say that blogs = emigre+ death, I do have to agree that something is missing in current design writing in general, and not just on blogs. Emigre filled that piece of the puzzle from time to time, and by the sounds of it, certainly in the times before my time (prior to 10 or 15 yrs ago).

I think it's a mistake to say "that was the revolution then, it's gone, and done; we're in peaceful times now" because inevitably someone will come along and challenge something we take as fundamental, and it will only be in hindsight that we will think "yeah, that was important stuff."

I agree that the blog itself has been revolutionary in its form, but I also think it has yet to find its ideal form. It is like the early "talkies" they were an exciting evolution of film, but it took a while for them to figure out what to say.

I do think we very often devolve to this much maligned "chatter," and sometimes i despair that we will ever come out of it, but now and then we really do.

I think that the blog has yet to meet the spirit of Emigre, and as Armin pointed out, Speak Up doesn't have that mandate. At least not today.

Sorry, I'm a little tired ... these comments look half-baked, as am i.

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:11 PM
Randy’s comment is:

I doubt that Poynor would call his fellow Founding Writers lovers of their own hype

Considering that Rick Poyner announced his own resignation from authoring on Design Observer in the same piece, I would not assume that he wasn't referring both Design Observer and Speak Up.

As contradictory and self-referential as the last iteration of Emigre was, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:19 PM
ben...’s comment is:

i thought speak up was a discussion board, forum, source, not a blog. blogs are retarded. they talk about how people are shocked that their cat peed on their pillows and stuff. emigre is/was the only design mag that placed words about design on pages and it meant something. everything else just smears the ink across the paper...

make speak up a mag...i'd probably buy it.

On Nov.17.2005 at 02:44 PM
mandy’s comment is:

A magazine and a blog do not compete for the same space simply because they discuss the same subject. If they did, nearly every magazine currently in print would be preparing to close its doors.

Whenever a publication fails, there's an inevitable circling of the grave. But the fact is publications die for one reason only: people don't want to read them anymore. In the history of human civilization, only a handful of texts have failed to meet this fate. Emigre is in good company.

On Nov.17.2005 at 03:02 PM
Valon’s comment is:

Speak-Up didn't really kill Emgire!

Even though I'm fairly new to the profession I had a chance to enjoy few of the latest Emigre issues and I thought they were absolutely great. However, what Speak-Up has done is somewhat model itslef along those line and provide enough flexibility in its writings that leave room for me to comment on, get mad at, RANT, and so forth...

So, in other words I think of Emigre as far gone rather than dead... "Back then" it was a time for Emigre and things like that, NOW is the time of speed, blogging, writing...everything has to move fast.

I have to say that "part" of my post-school upbringing knowledge about design, ethics, business...you name it...come from posts and discussions in Speak-Up.

Don't get me wrong! Emigre will still hold its own shelf on my library and Speak-Up will be one of my favorite bookmarks on my Firefox.

Let's see where we go from here...

On Nov.17.2005 at 03:06 PM
debbie millman’s comment is:

I am going to go out on a limb with this...

My guess is that many Speak-Up readers had never even heard of Emigre before they came across Speak-Up...

hmmmmm.

On Nov.17.2005 at 03:44 PM
Darrel’s comment is:

If they did, nearly every magazine currently in print would be preparing to close its doors.

You will note that many succesful magazines also strive to have a solid online presense, be it blogging, community, etc.

I agree, they take up different spaces, but to ignore the web completely, then blame it for one's demise is rather pointless.

Emigre was great in that they actually wrote about stuff, though. I recently got offered a dual subscription to Print + How for something like $30. I hadn't read those mags religiously for a long while but the price was cheap and so I grabbed them. I now get them and they pretty much just sit on top of the toilet.

So, for me, at least, I do read many more blogs than I do magazines these days. Of the magazines I do read, they at least attempt at connecting with an online audience as well.

On Nov.17.2005 at 03:44 PM
sgj’s comment is:

Earlier this summer, while having lunch with a friend, I asked had he read the latest Emigre (#68—American Mutt…), as it mentioned his current Creative Director several times.

This guy is, in my opinion, going to be my generation's Paul Rand, Neville Brody, Robert Brownjohn. He has more passion for design than any other person I have ever met (student, professional, or academic). This is the guy I call to get recommendations and criticism on new design books, journals, articles, even my own work.

His response to my question, "I stopped reading Emigre when they changed format to those little CDs. I bought Rant, but never finished reading it… It just didn't inspire me the same way that the older formats did. It felt like reading a dictionary."

I was surprised by his response, but remember thinking the same thing with each new issue I had received. While I had found enough value in the discourse inside, he had lost his love and attention based on the new format of issue 60 (Honey Barbara—2001), and again with 64 (Rant—2003).

I will greatly miss the discourse provided by Emigre, and will continue to expand my collection of back issues. However, I feel that blaming "Blogs" for the death of a 21yr old publication is misdirected, and using platforms such as Speak Up as a scapegoat.

On Nov.17.2005 at 04:14 PM
Valon’s comment is:

My guess is that many Speak-Up readers had never even heard of Emigre before they came across Speak-Up...

Actually, I found out about Speak-Up through Emigre...the one with the article with Armin...can't remember which one.

I think I even wrote Armin telling him how happy I was to find out about this place...

It was like an epiphany to me back then : )

On Nov.17.2005 at 04:40 PM
ben...’s comment is:

In the most recent editions of Emigre however, you're 'forced' to read rather than look at all the pretty pictures and sensory overload of the bumblegum commercial design mags. The overproduced and many times annoyingly ad-heavy issues of How, Print, ID, and CA, don't even hold a match to the fire of Emigre. It is great to not have to fight my way past 100# cover weight, embossed foil stamped paper ads. Comparing Emigre to the other design mags on the shelf is like comparing an art history text to a Baby Einstein book. Emigre is art; it is for people who like to read, not for the folks who like to flip through a mag on the shitter...

On Nov.17.2005 at 04:45 PM
Matthew Chiavelli’s comment is:

I know I'm basically spitting on the grave of a publication and company that was a large part of my formative years as a graphic designer, but I think it's necessary to just put it bluntly here:

Emigre never "got" the web.

One only need look at thier site to drive this point home. The fact that the standard bearers of the new wave of graphic design and design discussion through the 80's and much of the 90's currently have a website that's embarassing by the standards of nearly a decade ago shows just how severely they missed the boat.

I watched the web go virtually unnoticed in Emigre's pages well past the time that it was obviously not a fad, but quite possibly the most important communication development since the invention of the printing press. Why Emigre chose to ignore a medium that was in desperate need of intelligent design critique and discourse will forever baffle and disappoint me.

I'll admit, Emigre was on the cutting edge with digital font delivery in the early days (via email), but that edge dulled almost immediately. I watched with some sadness as indie type foundries, many run by a single person, began to eat Emigre's lunch online with websites that not only looked incredible, but also offered powerful functionality such as the ability to preview a line of text in a font onscreen before you purchased it.

I remember the letters to the editor in the late 90's in Emigre's printed pages about how pathetic their site was. Rudy VanderLans' response was always along the lines of "We're keeping it simple to make it easier to use and to keep it compatible with all browsers." His dismissive responses seemed to lump anything but bare text in a browser together with a page full of background patterns and blink tags. Even in 1998, it was obviously a cop-out. Suddenly, the pioneers of computer-based graphic design were sounding an awful lot like the clueless big media companies who were tripping over their own feet while trying to get on the web. Not to mention the fact that this attitude seemed to contradict their earlier print design experiments that pushed the limits of legibility and "safe" design practices.

Emigre could have embraced the communication potential of this medium. Emigre could have been Speak Up or Design Observer, with a five year head start. For whatever reason, they chose not to.

As a fan, Emigre's slide into irrelevance during the .com boom was tough to watch. I honestly thought that the pioneers of digitally-created graphic design and fonts would be the first in line to use this powerful medium in innovative ways. Sadly, they were not.

Maybe the reason I'm finding it hard to be sad about the end of Emigre as a magazine is that I haven't gotten over feeling let down by them at a time the design community needed a digital equivalent of the community they themselves had created and catered to so well in the previous years.

On Nov.17.2005 at 05:48 PM
vibranium’s comment is:

I knew of Emigre waaay before SU or DO or even the internet (I think? Right? Close...)

I love Emigre...but mostly i love the IDEA of Emigre.

At times it got waaay too heady for me. I still will keep all my issues, and the 10th anniversary book in the autographed slipcase. And I will still buy the typefaces.

On Nov.17.2005 at 08:07 PM
Ravenone’s comment is:

So now that it is dead, and we have another cry of "Blogs=TEH EVIL!!111"... how can the curious few who have not had a chance to read Emigre get a hold of back issues? -are they on amazon? what is the likeleyhood of getting them by inter-library loan?

-The Sleep Deprived Bird.

And, Darrel- if you don't want those copies of How and Print... I'll read them! :D

On Nov.18.2005 at 01:56 AM
Daniel Green’s comment is:

Chatter?

Noise?

On Speak Up??

Yes, yes!

And could not the same conditions be found in the cafes, pubs, and coffee houses of creative centers throughout the last century, where nimble minds gathered to challenge and support each other?

While it may be too soon to dub Speak Up or Design Observer as this century’s Moulin Rouge, perhaps we need to think of this medium, not just as a publication, but as a place. Perhaps we need to judge it not just for the quality of its content, but by the quality of its conversations.

Emigre will be missed. But it’s foolish to either dismiss or blame Speak Up.

Good post, Armin.

On Nov.18.2005 at 08:20 AM
Armin’s comment is:

> i thought speak up was a discussion board, forum, source, not a blog.

Ben, in all practicality, Speak Up is a blog. In spirit it may be different than those that talk about pets peeing on pillows, but it's still a blog.

On Nov.18.2005 at 08:40 AM
Jeff Gill’s comment is:

Ben, OMG!! I was so shocked to come home from a meeting today to find my cat had knocked a vase with a rose it all over my external DVD writer!!!! :-O

Beautiful, robust defence, Armin. Well done.

My DVD writer is fine. LOL!

On Nov.18.2005 at 09:08 AM
Jeff Gill’s comment is:

rose in it

On Nov.18.2005 at 09:09 AM
BlueStreak’s comment is:

I can't prove it, but I'm pretty sure that Armin and Bryony killed ITC's Uc&lc magazine too.

House Industries needs to watch their ass. I think they're next.

On Nov.18.2005 at 09:35 AM
Tom Gleason’s comment is:

"five years into the two thousands I have yet to find anyone in our field challenging [the status quo]. Not even Emigre."

This is why Design may die with Emigre.

This is a sad abuse of the power that you've generated (ironically) by channelling the critical energies of both generations, Armin.

SpeakUp will be remembered for being completely oblivious to it's own source and true potential.

On Nov.18.2005 at 09:59 AM
Dado Queiroz’s comment is:

note: I'm new to comments, and English is not my first language...

Anyway, in my opinion, Matthew Chiavelli’s comment said it all, and though I hadn't read issue n. 69 (to ship it to Brazil can be surprisingly expensive), I'm a bit shocked to hear that the autors actually blamed blogs for the end of Emigre, and thought of them as an "inferior" or "poorly explored" type of medium. I find that odd specially because Emigre itself — or Mr. VanderLans, for that matter — kind of praised SpeakUp in issue 65 or 66, in a way that I somehow even came to see them as "partners" (but this can perhaps have happened due to my defficient English... hehe).

I don't see SpeakUp as a blog either, even if technically or conceptually or wathever, it actually is. To be honest, I don't read the comments much, as I'm sort of a "traditional" reader after articles — specially when they're free and very well designed (I guess that's why I can't stand looking at Design Observer).

I do see, however, SpeakUp and possible similar initiatives filling in the void. Perhaps not the one left by Emigre, but, as Armin pointed, that's not even the goal. The fact that a great number of issues are discussed here, other then sustainable design and alikes, is due to the nature of the medium. I'm not a big fan of rebrandings business-like discussions either, but I don't mind that other people are. If you think of it, it's pretty nice actually, as you have one place that is democratic enough for so many and so different points of view to arise. This way, the Emigre bunch, for instance, can share their ideals with others, and not only — as someone I can't remember wrote in the magazine (in a different context) — "preach to the converted", as they usually do. This is a way of making a change, and SpeakUp has all the potential to do it. It's just a matter of stop whining and use it!

I guess that's it — I hope I didn't mess up your language too much...

Wich brings me to an interesting question: isn't it strange that Emigre is (was) run by someone from the Netherlands and that Armin is Mexican, and that Todd McFarlane (I used to like comics) is Canadian?? What's up with that?

On Nov.18.2005 at 10:07 AM
Darrel’s comment is:

Emigre is art; it is for people who like to read, not for the folks who like to flip through a mag on the shitter...

In case I wasn't clear, that was the point I was trying to make. ;o)

This is a sad abuse of the power that you've generated (ironically) by channelling the critical energies of both generations, Armin.

???

On Nov.18.2005 at 10:08 AM
ben...’s comment is:

Where are the Emigre writers in this discussion? Haven't they graced these boards before? I'm sure they are crafting something marvelous...

On Nov.18.2005 at 08:35 PM
Doug Bartow’s comment is:

>>This is why Design may die with Emigre.

...what a crock!

On Nov.18.2005 at 08:54 PM
Derrick Schultz’s comment is:

Its unfortunate that any person who is against blogs and believes they are killed Emigre probably wont participate in this one-sided debate, isnt it?

On Nov.18.2005 at 10:48 PM
JJeffryes’s comment is:

I'd heard of Emigre. I think I even saw an issue once. But I've never read it.

By choice.

It's always been painfully obvious that magazines like Print, How, etc., much less Emigre, never really understood what's going on in the new world of design. Emigre was dead 10 years ago, most of the other magazines shortly later. The fat annuals I still foolishly buy rarely have much relevance to the real design being done today.

If the publications have become ivory towers, withering as they gaze at their own magnificence, why should we cry when they disappear?

On Nov.19.2005 at 02:41 AM
Rob’s comment is:

It's always been painfully obvious that magazines like Print, How, etc., much less Emigre, never really understood what's going on in the new world of design.

Now that's a bit of crap. Emigre, while not necessarily web-savvy, brought a critical insight and opinion from some of most influential voices of the design world. And what exactly is the 'new world' of design? The tools may have changed, but design is still design.

Emigre played an important role in the design community, just as Speak-Up does. Maybe to a younger generation, the immediacy of Speak-Up is far more comforting than actually sitting down and reading a publication cover to cover, but that does not make the medium irrelevant.

And I think it's ridiculous to say that Speak-Up, or g-d forbid Design Observer, killed Emigre. Emigre has always, even within the design world, been a bit of a niche player. It's death is nothing more than Rudy's decision not to do it anymore.

Overall, I think Emigre will be missed by some and not by others. But all of us owe a bit of gratitude and thanks to Rudy for the time and effort he put into carrying and raising the bar on the level of design discussion and thought. And now that bar, it seems, rests in the hands of all of us.

On Nov.19.2005 at 07:27 AM
Pesky Illustrator’s comment is:

Amen, brother...

On Nov.19.2005 at 08:54 AM
Sam Potts Inc.’s comment is:

We are a breed of Emigre’s revolutionary aesthetics and sensibilities crossed with awe and respect for the tradition and the work of the people that forged this profession as we know it. We have little to rebel against because, despite our constant complaints, we have it good. We know where our profession is headed and we know it in part thanks to Emigre. Early on Rudy may have mentioned to me (or in one of his intros) that Speak Up is not challenging the status quo, and I have to admit that every day I wonder how I can challenge this quo full of status. The thing is, I personally don’t have any beef with it, and five years into the two thousands I have yet to find anyone in our field challenging it. [...] (ital and bf added by me)

By "we" I assume you are speaking for yourself, Armin. Speaking solely for myself, I have myriad difficulties coming to any kind of resolution about the future of my own work and my business, the true mission of it for me, and the fundamental need of it generally. Plus, my own "awe and respect" usually turns out to be misplaced when one gets up close (Tibor included) and I often suspect that such reverence runs counter to the desire (mine, at least) to outgrow what is Known To Be Good (aka, "tradition"). And I have lots of beefs with the status quo, starting with the stupid fact of its narrowness and how stunting it is to a potentially more diverse profession. If I had half your industriousness maybe I could do more to get it out there, but self-appointment's not really my thing, and it shouldn't come down to put-up-or-shut-up anyway.

I think you give rather short shrift to what it means to challenge the status quo. It can indeed seem like there's not much at stake these days. This is dangerous, I think, for the individual and the profession (and, to be unnecessarily grandiose, for society). There was a time when it seemed the Speak Up mission was to challenge the status quo, but that was a very different Speak Up. So be it. Alas.

Maybe there is still a collective hypnosis over the profession--as diagnosed in Rant and left untreated--that makes it hard to see who is challenging the status quo. No one said these lulls were brief. But I for one am desparately hopeful that someone is, and I'm not always a hopeful guy when it comes to the design profession. I would like there to be some more blood on the floor, a little revolution now and rather than then. Again, so be it. Alas.

Finally, if as you say "we know where our profession is headed" then we are either in a way more intellectually and imaginatively impoverished state than I ever imagined, or our standards are simply not high enough. Where is the wonder and delight and everything-good-in-the-world if we are already know what will happen? Why be satisfied with what is already known, especially when it comes to what is considered Good? As the saying goes, "If we don't be careful, we will surely end up where we are going."

Also, it's Kingsley's fault that I posted--he encouraged me.

On Nov.19.2005 at 01:24 PM
pk’s comment is:

Maybe there is still a collective hypnosis over the profession--as diagnosed in Rant and left untreated--that makes it hard to see who is challenging the status quo.

is this status quo ever defined anywhere? you can't challenge what you haven't identified. i mean, did anyone bother finding an enemy before chasing it?

also, another idea for emigre's decreasing importance is in the tools. emigre was fueled by people experimenting with the computer when it was fairly avant garde to do so. all of zuzana's early type is based on that, and a lot of the magazine's early layout is based on some of the primitive defaults in pagemaker.

noticeably, emigre didn't experiment the next time a new medium changed everything, so it's quite possible that it is simply time for someone else to pick up that particular torch and run with it.

actually, i think that torch is already being run with, the only diffference being that there's no magazine to document it.

On Nov.19.2005 at 01:46 PM
pk’s comment is:

is this status quo ever defined anywhere? you can't challenge what you haven't identified. i mean, did anyone bother finding an enemy before chasing it?

crap. i misread. i thought sam said something about this being an issue bandied about in the ish of emigre at hand.

i guess that question's really for you directly, sam, and probably totally offtopic from this thread. 'pologies.

On Nov.19.2005 at 02:01 PM
Joshua Ray’s comment is:

A Voice in the Wilderness

Armin is absolutely right. Speak Up did not kill Emigre. Speak Up doesn’t have the type of audacious instinct required to do such a thing. One could only say that Speak Up killed Emigre in the same way one could say that a neglectful gardener killed a prize plant by allowing weeds to strangle it out. This gardener is not a killer, he is simply lazy at best and populist or democratist at worst. A lazy gardener would be better because at least if he were simply lazy he would not place his highest value on mediocrity or majority. Unfortunately Speak Up is a gardener that thinks because the weeds are the most prolific they are therefore the most healthy, the most worthy, and the most excellent.

Truly Emigre and Speak Up have never occupied the same territory, certainly they are/were both for designers and about design, but to equate them based on such general requirements one may as well say Gandhi and Hitler occupied the same territory. Speak Up, from its inception, has had clearly different values than Emigre. There is overlap to be sure, how could there not be, but the essential difference is this: Emigre at its best required one to think, Speak Up simply requires one to choose. Anyone, indeed anything, can choose, but thinking is another matter altogether. Thinking is hard. Thinking is often painful. Thinking requires one to consider the ramifications of one’s choices. Any monkey can choose to thrust its hand into a jar to take the last cookie; driven by myopic appetites it is the very rare monkey indeed that can even begin to grasp that the price of its myopia is life. But as Kierkegaard said: “A delusion is a state of mind in which one is least able to think of that of which one most needs to think.”

Which brings us to the real issue at hand. The issue that no critic of the design-blog has even skirted and which Speak Up’s constituents are necessarily wholly unaware of. I am talking about a cultural blind spot the size of which the word spot doesn’t even come close to doing justice, it is more like a blind universe. The issue is perfectly encapsulated in Armin’s closing paragraph: “Nonetheless, this — this moment, this blog, this discussion, this imminent redesign of the AT&T logo— is the reality we live in and I’m glad as hell to be part of it”. The implications of this statement ring true throughout the entire history of the Speak Up forum specifically and modern society generally, that is: we live in the best of all possible worlds. The incessant discussions about the imminent redesign of the AT&T logo, and logos in general, take for granted that there is substantive value in such topics. These discussions are completely blind to the much more daunting and challenging issues involved in the design profession. For instance: when all of the people trained in the visual manipulation of signs and symbols are not only utter slaves to, but willing advocates of, massive and wholesale manipulation of the public on behalf of potentially evil corporations, that have proven repeatedly and repeatedly they could give two shits about that same public, what kind of future world does that imply? What kind of present world does it imply? When all of the people trained in the visual manipulation of signs and symbols are not only utter slaves to, but willing advocates of, massive and wholesale manipulation of the public on behalf of potentially good corporations what does that imply? When it is an unquestionable fact that the economic system in which we live and slavishly bind ourselves to is the only possible one where does that leave us? When those of us who make a living creating, filtering, and disseminating advertising, propaganda, persuasive symbols, and seductive imagery wholesale believe it too much to ask to also be critical what do we end up with? We are part of a profession that consistently congratulates itself on the manipulative, or rhetorical, power that it wields but never seems to consider the responsibility that entails. Speak Up is the perfect vehicle for this profession, it can’t even comprehend what is at stake. It can’t even begin to ask the important questions because it doesn’t see them as being important, as a matter of fact it doesn’t see them at all.

Speak Up eschews true criticality in favor of opinionizing argumentation. This is, of course, to be expected from the type of feel-good mentalities that Speak Up attracts as its most vocal and active participants, to be expected but not excused. This type of mentality at best thinks that criticality is synonymous with negativity or meanness and at worst thinks of it as an agreement to disagree—the first at least recognizes the painful sting involved in critique. As I said this mentality is to be expected, it is the overwhelmingly pervasive mentality in our society, so overwhelming that even the dictionary reflects it. The first entry for critical: inclined to find fault or to judge with severity, often too readily. I am fully aware this definition will be sufficient, to the type of uncritical mind that takes everything at face value, to repudiate my claims to the contrary, but I will make them regardless. Critical has as its root critic, which has as its etymological root the Greek kritikos, meaning skilled in judging. To be critical entails the ability to distinguish the essential and crucial aspects of whatever is at the moment being critiqued. Nietzsche suggested that we philosophize with a hammer and this suggestion was much more subtle than it sounds. He did mean that we should smash weak ideals and beliefs that are becoming bloated and decadent, but he also meant that we should handle the hammer with the delicate touch of a master bell maker hammering from all sides, listening carefully to ensure the bell strikes the right tone.

For a truly critical soul critique is always leveled first and foremost at itself. Knowing this can always help us discern if we are being faced with useful critique or not. In Armin’s “critique” he wrote, somewhat facetiously: “surely Speak Up is not stepping up to the task by not exploring new design aesthetics, by not challenging the status quo, by not being an actual printed thing that can be championed in a bookshelf and, above all, by being unedited — although I could potentially take offense at that.” He could take offense, but he shouldn’t. If he were a truly critical editor he would never allow the many mistakes that occur in his own writing. In the same paragraph that he potentially takes offense to his editing skills being called into question he says this: “we are not armed with nary a stone”, I believe that is known as a double negative. I am no grammarian myself but it doesn’t take one to see the mistake here, clearly he is intending the opposite but the results of this sentence is that he is, in fact, armed with a stone. In the promotion for Stop Being Sheep the term “ephemerity” is used twice, there is no such term. The word he was looking for is ephemerality (opinionizing, the term I used earlier, is also not technically a word, it is a coinage, which I can’t take credit for, that works within the relatively modular rules for word building that the English language facilitates—ephemerity, however, does not). In his Emigre letter he says this: “I did find an appropriate metaphor and rather than weave it subtly I will deploy it ungracefully... Emigre is like New York City’s subway trains.” Ungraceful indeed, that is not a metaphor it is a simile (perhaps here is where we call into question Rudy’s immaculate editorial scorecard because he certainly should have caught that). Technically had Armin just deleted “like” he would have made a metaphor but that would indicate the simplest understanding of metaphor. Those of us who could say, for instance: “a metaphor is like a simile but without the like” can’t begin to comprehend the truly transformative power of metaphor, its absolutely integral and primordial relationship to language. The coup de grace in uncriticality is Armin’s statement in Emigre: “...your experience on the train will vary, much like with an issue of Emigre. Possible uncertainties include but are not limited to: a smooth and critical journey...” This notion of criticality comes from Armin specifically but is indicative of Speak Up in general. Criticality never goes down like a milkshake. The type of mentality that could honestly equate a critical journey with a smooth one has never experienced a truly critical one. To that type of mind a true critique must have an effect similar to the screeching wall of noise that the ATF blared at David Koresh and his followers for days during the Waco standoff; in this case critique could cause nothing but a fit of convulsive spasms akin to the body rejecting a putrid morsel, or milkshake.

I can attest to the difficulties of criticality specifically in relation to writing this essay. As I read and re-read, write and re-write, think and re-think my body is experiencing real agonies. I have been taxing my brain so hard in the last few days since reading Armin’s missive and formulating this response that I am literally experiencing physical pain, my head is pounding, my back is hurting, my digestion is ruined. I am willing, indeed eager, to subject myself to such physical and psychological tortures because that is the import I place on honing the ability to form values. Our ability to evaluate is what makes us human, it is what allows us to step outside of time, it is what allows us to transcend our mortality. The less and less we truly cultivate our evaluating critical facilities the more and more we are made slaves to anyone in a position to manipulate our myopia. While we sit at our computers championing our freedom to choose our freedom to create is being eaten away, and we are the ones doing the eating—too desensitized and self-satisfied to even recognize the terrifying enormity of what is at stake.

Though few practice it I can think of virtually no one who would dispute the wisdom in the Chinese proverb: “Give me a fish and I eat for a day. Teach me to fish and I eat for a lifetime.” At its best Speak Up actually does practice this saw, but there is an element of utilitarianism implied even in this bit of wisdom. Modernity and its emphasis on specialization has slowly creeped in to the implications buried in this time worn saying. For what happens when there are no more fish to eat? When there are no more seas to fish? I say let’s go farther. I say this: Teach me to teach myself. But do this and you’ve created a monster, verily I say unto thee a monster will have been created. No one comprehends this better than those with real power. And no one is better served by ensuring that our truly uncritical masses never know this than those with dominion over us. But, of course, that is someone else’s problem, what could we possibly do about it?

On Nov.19.2005 at 10:44 PM
Joshua Ray’s comment is:

And speaking of necessary self-critique I let one get by as well:

Which brings us to the real issue at hand. The issue that no critic of the design-blog has even skirted and which Speak Up’s constituents are necessarily wholly unaware of.

this should say:

Which brings us to the real issue at hand, the issue that no critic of the design-blog has even skirted and which Speak Up’s constituents are necessarily wholly unaware of.

On Nov.19.2005 at 11:11 PM
Su’s comment is:

Godwin has been invoked. End of discussion.

But:

Any monkey can choose to thrust its hand into a jar to take the last cookie; driven by myopic appetites it is the very rare monkey indeed that can even begin to grasp that the price of its myopia is life.

Near-sighted monkey + cookie = death. Gotcha.

You're almost making a few points here. I think. You seem a bit too fixated on being lyrical and well..."deep"...to actually make a coherent argument, not to mention some rather novel usage of logic. Could've used an editor. Funny, that.

And, Joshua? It's generally considered extremely poor form, in any forum, to critique someone's grammar. Particularly seeing as you're admittedly not a grammarian.

And in light of your apparent deep fondness for run-on sentences.

*beat*

It's "let's go further," by the way.

Attacking the person rather than their argument is fun!

On Nov.20.2005 at 12:24 AM
Su’s comment is:

[PK always yells at me for not explaining these things.]

Godwin's Law

[Learn to fish on your own damn time.]

On Nov.20.2005 at 12:31 AM
Abi Huynh’s comment is:

There is so much left to say about design today...so much 'shaping' to do. You just have to be able to look a bit harder.

On Nov.20.2005 at 03:29 AM
Armin’s comment is:

> By "we" I assume you are speaking for yourself, Armin. Speaking solely for myself

Sam, I would never, ever include you in any "we" statement when it comes to anything related to design —�and I mean no offense by that.

> I would like there to be some more blood on the floor, a little revolution now and rather than then.

I know this is a metaphor — well, I may actually not know what a metaphor is apparently — but whose blood?

> Finally, if as you say "we know where our profession is headed" then we are either in a way more intellectually and imaginatively impoverished state than I ever imagined, or our standards are simply not high enough.

I can't say I disagree. But more or less. Design is in a complacent state.

Joshua,

I appreciate the pains you went through. And if I have done something — even if lazily, democratically or populistingly (how do you like them grammar now?) as you presume — over the years is listen to critiques of Speak Up, so your comments do not fall on deaf ears. This whole discussion has been very helpful in realizing what Speak Up has come to be and how it can or can not be better or worse.

I have to agree with Su though, it would have been a little less childish to leave the grammar comments out of your diarrhea-inducing critique. We can all use help when writing. Too bad you had to bring up such a petty concern.

On Nov.20.2005 at 09:21 AM
Joshua Ray’s comment is:

Su, you seem to be missing at least one of my many points. You may have a nausea inducing distaste for complex sentence structure, but just because a sentence runs long doesn’t mean it is a run-on. A run-on sentence is one that contains at least two independent clauses with no punctuation. Show me some examples of that in my essay. Here is a sample of a complex sentence taken from a randomly flipped to page of Nabokov’s Lolita:

“True, the accident had been reported only by the Ramsdale Journal—not by the Parkington Recorder or the Climax Herald, Camp Q being in another state, and local deaths having no federal news interest; but I could not help fancying that somehow Dolly Haze had been informed already, and that at the very time I was on my way to fetch her, she was being driven to Ramsdale by friends unknown to me.”

Should I be taking my cues from a true master of the English language, or someone with so little respect for language he can’t be bothered to formulate a complete sentence? Should I be learning from one who resorts lazily to half remembered rules of proper usage? According to the multiple sources I perused farther and further are, in fact, interchangeable except when being used to mean “moreover,” in which case it must be further. Clearly I didn’t mean moreover. I meant to a greater extent or degree, which can be found in both definitions.

Apparently grammar is a children’s game now? I admit to struggling mightily to understand it more fully so I must be childish. It is one thing to harp on petty trifles, it is quite another to attempt exposing a pattern of neglect and misuse. I could have picked out many petty examples of obviously coincidental flaws (here are a couple: Elliot spells his name with 2 t’s—Elliott, “Speak Up is not, nor it wants to be Emigre”—I read that misplaced it as purely coincidental and move on), but what I am attempting to illuminate is structural damage not cracks in the facade. I suppose that in the adult world we are to assume that, regardless of all evidence to the contrary, everyone understands and respects language in the same way? And corellatively we understand and respect each other in the same way? In the adult world we are constantly required to conform to unwritten, unjustified, unagreed upon, and collectively assumed rules of proper behavior, which more often than not contradict each other in subtle, infuriating, and increasingly complex ways. That is precisely the adult world my entire essay was about. So be it, I am childish.

On Nov.20.2005 at 06:53 PM
Henrik Tandberg’s comment is:

Armin, I think I smell your blood on the floor.

I hope you consider what this blog possibly could be. I hope instead of being content with the way design is you constantly question it... with a hammer. You could be known as the designer/editor who took blogs to a higher level. If you don't somebody else will, and he or she will probably have some beef with the status quo

On Nov.20.2005 at 07:18 PM
Armin’s comment is:

Well, Henrik, anyone can run a blog these days, right? I mean, it's so goddamned easy. So, by all means, anyone out there, please, start a blog that challenges the status quo. See how well it does. I'll be cheering.

On Nov.20.2005 at 07:26 PM
Dado Queiroz’s comment is:

Now, I must be very stupid or incredibly crazy to write anything else in this discussion, as it now looks much more like a battle field - one where the armies involved seem to have forgotten the reason why they started fighting in the first place. As I mentioned earlier, English is not my first langauge, so to hell with my possible mistakes. I'm pretty critical of my writing in Portuguese already, so...

Y'know, Joshua, I think you're the kind of critic that makes other people feel bad about critical writing. Because, despite of what you might have said, your critique is just plain destruction. You should challenge people to give their best, encourage them to try harder and become better, not to dismiss their efforts in such a crude, pointless way. I didn't like what you wrote not because I don't get English very well or because you write overly "ornamented" long and confusing phrases but, mostly, because I found it rather boring, pointless and shallow. I imagine your first goal when writing something should be to engage the reader. And don't come back with some "to hell with the reader" response becuase, if you spent so much time formulating your intelectual wanna be phrases and quoting people smarter than you, you were obviously aiming at having your text read, right?

I mean, you showed the kind of attitude that makes people almost affraid of stating out what they think. We're all ducking here and I too think we all must stand up, but, just as one tries to do that, an over confident asshole such as yourself shoots them down, for some reason that might lie underneath the thousands of wasted characters you wrote. That doesn't seem to change the situation for me.

On Nov.20.2005 at 07:39 PM
Armin’s comment is:

And one quick ammendment to my last comment: What could Speak Up possibly be? Seriously. Bryony and I were having this discussion on the subway this afternoon and we couldn't come up with an answer other than a perhaps looming fate for it. So, again, please, anyone?

On Nov.20.2005 at 07:43 PM
Su’s comment is:

Joshua, now you're just protesting too much. Your response to being told that your argument is incoherent bordering on unreadable, and your behavior is inappropriate is to defend the behavior? Riiiight. This is my stop. Dado has already pointed out some of the multitudinous flaws in your screed, so I'll leave it to him to follow up if he feels like.

I'd about come to a point where I saw whatever it was you were saying, but if all you can be bothered about is comma placement and fingers hitting the wrong keys, well...

If you think I have a distaste for complex sentence structure, you've clearly never read anything I've written. Not that I've commented anywhere in a long time, as a matter of policy.

As a sidenote, Nabokov—Lolita for that matter—is for multiple reasons quite possibly the most amusing example you could've tried to use against me, but you wouldn't know that. Thanks for the laugh, though.

My distaste is for bullshit and pomposity, both of which you have dealt out by the handful. Seeing as you've turned your irritating proofreading fixation onto me now rather than yourself, I'll tell you that I write as I choose to, and will continue to in any cases where I'm not required to adhere to an external style guide. Though your little habit makes me wonder about your estimation of say...Joyce. But don't bother actually contacting me about it.

Good day, sir. You bore me.

On Nov.20.2005 at 09:17 PM
Ravenone’s comment is:

Joshua-

What really do you hope to acomplish by your lengthy diatribe? English, while important in communication, is not everything, and sniping at people for poor mistakes that ANYONE could make (Including yourself, dear sir), is worse than the mistakes themselves. Your attacks border on personal and trite, and serve as an example to us all of just how dangerous a smug sense of verbal superiority can be, especially when it has only the effect of making the reader look away in disgust or distaste.

However, if making people wince and cringe is your thing, kudos. But Tristan Tzara and his crew did it better.

So again: What exactly is the point of your ranting and raving?

On Nov.20.2005 at 09:50 PM
Héctor Mu�oz’s comment is:

They are just sore for not being able to sell their magazine anymore and jealous of loosing protagonism against blogs.

On Nov.20.2005 at 10:04 PM
Ravenone’s comment is:

But.. *sniffle* I thought blogs were the antichrist and really out to get us (along with evolution)! They're EVIL.

On Nov.20.2005 at 10:05 PM
m. kingsley’s comment is:

Joshua, yes, there's a lot of bad writing in the world, and much wonderful prose to be found. Personally, I would have chosen the following passage from Gulliver's Travels. It says much about the tiny, tiny design kingdoms that comments like yours encourage.

Which two mighty Powers have, as I was going to tell you, been engaged in a most obstinate War for six and thirty Moons past. It began upon the following Occasion. It is allowed on all Hands, that the primitive way of breaking Eggs, before we eat them, was upon the larger End: But his present Majesty's Grand-father, while he was a Boy, going to eat an Egg, and breaking it according to the ancient Practice, happened to cut one of his Fingers. Whereupon the Emperor his Father published an Edict, commanding all his Subjects, upon great Penaltys, to break the smaller End of their Eggs. The People so highly resented this Law, that our Histories tell us there have been six Rebellions raised on that account; wherein one Emperor lost his Life, and another his Crown. … It is computed, that eleven thousand Persons have, at several times, suffered Death, rather than submit to break their Eggs at the smaller End. Many hundred large Volumes have been published upon this Controversy: But the books of the Big-Endians have been long forbidden, and the whole Party rendered incapable by Law of holding Employments. During the Course of these Troubles, the Emperors of Blefuscu did frequently expostulate by their Ambassadors, accusing us of making a Schism in Religion, by offending against a fundamental Doctrine of our great Prophet Lustrog, in the fifty-fourth Chapter of the Brundrecal (which is their Alcoran.) This, however, is thought to be a meer Strain upon the Text: For the Words are these: That all true Believers shall break their Eggs at the convenient End: and which is the convenient End, seems, in my humble Opinion, to be left to every Man's Conscience, or at least in the power of the Chief Magistrate to determine. Now the Big-Endian Exiles have found so much Credit in the Emperor of Blefuscu's Court, and so much private Assistance and Encouragement from their Party here at home, that a bloody War has been carried on between the two Empires for six and thirty Moons with various Success…

My dear Mr. Potts, Quos come and Quos go. Myself, I never really thought that Speak Up was challenging anything other than the one-sidedness of "institutional" (those are ironic quotes) communication, i.e. AIGA missives, design publications, and books. Perhaps what you're missing is the collective exhilaration of discovering an outlet and a more direct way to establish contact with peers.

If by chance, you're referring to any other kind of status quo… could it be larger cultural/economic issues of our clients?

Over the weekend I heard John Ralston Saul present his new book and its thesis that (contrary to the Thomas L. Friedman mantra) the rise of nationalism and the reappearance of racism point to the end of globalization. He suggests that we're currently in a directionless vacuum period between globalization and what will come next — god knows what that will be. And as goes business, politics and culture; so goes design.

Or maybe not... but, at least Ralston Saul's given me food for thought. His point that economic theories last no more than a few decades fits many other things — Emigre included — and has a resonance in fellow Canadian Marshall McLuhan's The Relation of Environment to Anti-Environment (link in the left column).

Armin — what could Speak Up possibly be? No more and no less than the contributions and energy of everyone involved. Big-Endians and Small-Endians alike.

On Nov.21.2005 at 04:12 AM
Michael B.’s comment is:

I think

Which brings us to the real issue at hand, the issue that no critic of the design-blog has even skirted and which Speak Up’s constituents are necessarily wholly unaware of.

would be better as

Which brings us to the real issue at hand, the issue that no critic of the design-blog has even skirted and of which Speak Up’s constituents are necessarily wholly unaware.

Not sure what it means, exactly, but at least now we don't end with a preposition. I fucking hate that.

Yours for more perfect grammar and ever-deeper critical discourse,

Michael B.

On Nov.21.2005 at 08:00 AM
vibranium’s comment is:

HA! Love it.

;-)

On Nov.21.2005 at 08:08 AM
Bryony’s comment is:

Emigre at its best required one to think, Speak Up simply requires one to choose. Anyone, indeed anything, can choose, but thinking is another matter altogether. Thinking is hard. Thinking is often painful. Thinking requires one to consider the ramifications of one’s choices.

If thinking ends in choice selection, the choices presented in Speak Up are a direct consequence of collective thinking.

That my dear Joshua, is my painkiller.

On Nov.21.2005 at 09:00 AM
Sam Potts’s comment is:

And isn't "institutional" another way of saying "status quo," Mark? Your ironic quotes are noted, but that is precisely the former spirit of Speak Up I was talking about (sic/preposition). Of course quos come and go--that is the nature of revolutions. Fidel becomes the monarch, and so on. But in the big picture, if connecting with peers and giving an outlet (interesting word with the connotation of venting and ranting rather than of contemplation) to a wider number of people [than print media]--if that is the legacy of blogs in general then I'm not sure there's all that much to it. Being an outlet is just a matter of media rather than ideas themselves.

If blogs merely deliver the same old point of view on the status quo, then I say "Alas." This was entirely my original point. Different people arguing the same worn ruts of this logo or bowing to the same old icons doesn't seem to me like much of an advance in the dialogue on design, and isn't that the point of bringing lots of new people into the discussion? Blogs being a new medium doesn't, thus far, seem to have brought about a corresponding new point of view.

I cannot answer your question, Armin. I can only say that one need only to read this thread from my earlier comment onwards to watch it degenerate into the pettiest bickering. One of the many problems with blogs is that no one seems to have any consideration that their "outletting" is a waste of everyone else's time. Please consider your responsibility to your readers, people!

On Nov.21.2005 at 10:11 AM
Tom Gleason’s comment is:

Thank you for the much-needed inspiration, Joshua.

I find your contribution to this thread to be fascinating, perfectly readable, faultless in critical values and, most importantly, sincere.

When I wrote my brief criticism I immediately apologized to Armin and told him that he could delete it if he wanted to. I did this because I had developed a paralyzing fear of my own critical abilities--or, as I'll try to explain, my own critical inabilities.

It is never my intention to hurt anyone through criticism, nor is it the intention of sincere criticism to do anything but help, but as you know: when you are existing on a certain level sometimes you project your own abilities onto others; you assume that they could have the same degree of equanimity toward assertions made in the realm of argumentation.

You habitually assume that they have entered into the discussion with the same degree of radical humility and interest in truth (otherwise you wouldn't bother). When they begin to object in unproductive ways, it is a sign that you may have made some kind of error in regard to skillful means. At this level of critical practice, it is important to remember that "the best of all possible worlds" is not even this relatively open and personally somewhat enjoyable one in which we must be constantly offending others with the "truth".

We can imagine a world where this struggle between wisdom and ignorance does not exist; we can imagine a situation where everyone is "getting it". So, the goal at this level is to design this experience for ourselves. It is certainly agonizing to perceive so much ignorance in others. It is crucial here to value the validity of others' experience, myopic as it may seem, for unless we do that, we will be blind to our own deficiencies. Living in a world full of ignorance is a reminder that our own experience is not yet fully refined, designed, consistent with our ultimate desire. For that, a completely new kind of humility is necessary. Normal humility recognizes the superiority of some others. Special humility recognizes the validity of all others, as well as their superiority in the sense that they have asserted their own validity and we nevertheless have not fully seen this truth.

Anyway, I am happy to say that Armin didn't seem to want to delete my criticism. He seemed to think it was valid. In this case, Armin proved to be my superior, since he recognized that my experience was valid even when I didn't believe it myself. Somehow, I was offended by my own words, when he was not.

It remains a mystery whether or not real critical discussion is possible on SpeakUp. Armin is proudly complacent, and yet we should recognize this as a valid though frustrating postmodern position. Yes, it seems to be the case that this disguises a conservative agenda. No, to some of us it doesn't seem like the real is the rational. But the real is the real, and it is up to us to accept that this reality is, to our own eyes, a disgusting reality. When we recognize this state of affairs (where we are constantly in agonizing war with the ignorance of others due to our own ignorance) as thoroughly disgusting, then new opportunities reveal themselves.

What the world of design is waiting for is a new breed of critics who turn their criticism in toward themselves to a more profound level than ever before, in order to finally become effective at what they do. The blogs can be training for this, in a way that Emigre couldn't.

The new critics will be able to lead others by designing for themselves a perfect experience of the world. They will have recognized the futility of every kind of outer struggle (clearly, offending people with uninvited truth is sometimes counterproductive), and will have become so immersed in the process of creating positive experiences that there will be no room for any kind of negativity. There will be no negativity to dish out, and there will be no negativity to be experienced. Perhaps this is what Armin is pointing toward. At some point, on some level, we have to realize that we are creating our own negativity.

As the design discourse expands, we find that "design" is such an integral part of everything that it is hardly able to be contained. Ellen Lupton is playing with "designing life"--and that hits at the essence of where the understanding of design is naturally headed. History of Design has been pointing to this, in deeper and deeper ways. That is what my "Point" blog had been pointing toward, but never quite reaching due to my own frantic and ridiculous struggle with "outside" ignorance.

Design is an enlightenment project, since it implies ever more profound and supreme reasoning. All great enlightenment thinkers, east and west, have always come to the conclusion that it is ultimately a project of the individual, who could only ever enlighten the world by becoming enlightened oneself. They enlighten the world by example, by enlightening the world by experiencing it as enlightened. When we learn to see the validity of others, they can learn to see it in themselves. Then, and seemingly only then, can we have enough openness to trust in Reason to allow design to happen to us.

On Nov.21.2005 at 11:49 AM
Michael Dooley’s comment is:

Ben wrote, "Where are the Emigre writers in this discussion?"

I continue to read and post when I can. Sometimes time is a problem. I'm thankful for the Thanksgiving break. My feedback follows, for anyone who may still be reading these comments.

Armin wrote, "Michael Dooley also expresses a tinge of disappointment: 'Since the dust has settled, everyone now engages in relatively mundane blog chats about branding and such.' ... since we outnumber Design Observer in 'mundane blog chats about branding' I’m positive Dooley is referring to Speak Up."

Okay, two points. First, if I'd wanted to refer to Speak Up alone I would have said so. But I didn't: to my point, see DO's AT&T discussion (word count currently exceeding Speak Up's) re. "branding." And let's not drop the end of my sentence: see design blogs in general re. "... and such."

But here's the more important point: my Emigre essay was not, in any way, an attack on blogs, and anyone who interprets it as such is wrong.

My essay dealt with "Kicking Up a Little Dust," my 1992 Print magazine article about Emigre, and stated, "In less than a decade of existence, it had become both popular and provocative for producing texts and graphics that assaulted Modernism, traditional legibility, and even the whole graphic design profession."

My essay further dealt with the huge "Cult of the Ugly" imbroglio, and stated, "In the late eighties and early nineties the design community had become galvanized in unprecedented numbers, and argued with intense passion. But revolution eventually leads to resolution..."

Hence, "Since the dust has settled..." and "... relatively mundane..." Context, baby. The blogosphere is currently the primary environment for public debate of contemporary design issues. The notion that I implied anything less, uh, mundane is, uh, nonsense.

On Nov.25.2005 at 08:25 PM
Armin’s comment is:

> Hence, "Since the dust has settled..." and "... relatively mundane..." Context, baby.

Michael, I agree, context is everything; sorry to have pulled out that sentence on its own. I guess I am hopeful that those following this discussion may have read Emigre 69 and gotten the full picture.

However, I do think the "relatively mundane" — whether in contrast to "The Cult of the Ugly" or as a standalone statement — choice of words reflected properly on the trend in Emigre (at least in the past 2-3 issues) that branding=boring+useless+wrong. So that's where I was coming from when picking out that quote.

On Nov.27.2005 at 09:23 AM
marc english’s comment is:

All Things Must Pass. i still own that album and haven't played it in it's entirety since.... the 70s? somewhere around the studio i have a box of emigre back issues from 15 years ago. and on my typography shelf, the orange.... i just looked....some former intern must have walked off with my oversized-emigre orange book. haven't opened it in years, so i hope it is in good hands.

when the 70s ended i got rid of my steely dan and paul mccartney albums, and but for 3 or 4 songs, don't miss them. i remember times with others listening to then fondly, but have managed to live without them.

emigre occupied a certain place and space in contemporary design they should be rightfully proud of. the words may fade away - without constant reprints - but i think their legacy will stand in their typography. i bought the typefaces, not the dogma. i bought the spirit, not the religion.

blogs? whole 'nother story. and no doubt this too, shall pass.

On Dec.02.2005 at 02:05 PM
Kenneth FitzGerald’s comment is:

i bought the typefaces, not the dogma. i bought the spirit, not the religion.

Okay, Marc, you finally got me interested in this topic. Please articulate precisely what the "Emigre dogma" or "religion" is. You'll need to attribute it to something Rudy VanderLans wrote. Yes, this is a trick question.

On Dec.02.2005 at 08:10 PM
marc english’s comment is:

kenneth

ya know i love ya, but as i can see i've already stepped in dogma here, i'd just attribute it to any school of thought from buddhism to bauhaus, without going into specifics, leaving it for wiser minds than mine to eludicate the precise points to which you refer. i haven't read any of rudy's stuff in the past decade (no offense to rudy, as i like his stuff). you don't have to go to church to feel the spirit. and you can certainly take the life out of anything by dissecting it. i was never any good with trick questions.

On Dec.05.2005 at 04:29 PM
aizan’s comment is:

blogs might not have editors, but they have groupthink for that.

as much as i despise blogs, i don't blame them for emigre's death. as a matter of fact, what caused its death is the same thing that gives blogs their life.

On Jan.08.2006 at 02:20 PM
Kenneth FitzGerald’s comment is:

Mark,

I love and respect you too, even if you have a blind spot a mile wide about all things Emigre. That's okay! Next time I see you, I'll flash you my Whirligig tattoo--personally inked by Zuzana Licko herself! All us Emigrunts have 'em!

But dawg, WTF with Emigre as Steely Dan? Rudy wished he'd moved that many units! You're coming off like a Deadhead dissing The Velvet Underground as artsy failures who couldn't play their instruments (and every song's about shootin' smack or sucking ding-dongs!) Next you'll be telling me Elliott Earls is design's Dan Fogelberg!

On Jan.09.2006 at 10:53 AM
Pesky Illustrator’s comment is:

FitzGerald,

>> Hey, where's MY Tattoo, dudster?

I tend to think of Emigre more as Van Dyke Parks of Design than SD, and Earls as the Captain Beefheart of design. That makes you Bert Bacharach, yes?

On Jan.09.2006 at 06:25 PM
Rudy V.’s comment is:

For what it's worth, blogs did not kill Emigre. At least I never said they did.

For those interested in knowing what really happened, Emigre magazine wasn't killed by anyone other than me. And the decision to do so happened when blogs were still in their infancy. Emigre magazine had run its course. I'd lost interest in publishing it. There didn't seem to be much left in graphic design that peeked my interest that I hadn't already covered.

I guess I could have moved Emigre online, as some suggested, but I had little interest in doing so. Although I don't remember ever claiming that this new medium wasn't pertinent, as others suggested. It simply wasn't pertinent to me. Not then.

Now, I don't want to poop on your parade, and diminish the value and influence of blogs. Blogs present yet another player on the design scene competing for readers and attention. They can not be easily dismissed. If I was publishing a design magazine right now, I'd be concerned. Especially since blogs are free. People love things that are free. I know, because the circulation of Emigre magazine reached 45,000 when it was free. Free is a hard thing to compete with.

Actually, one could argue that the main reason why blogs have become so popular is not the instantaneous responses, the open public dialog, the open source ideology (although those are its finest attributes). No, the reason why they have become so popular is because they are free. I'd be really curious to know how many people would visit SpeakUp if they had to pay for it. So as long as Armin is willing to pay the fees and do the all the heavy lifting, all others can boast about this terrific "public" medium.

But I stray.

What I wanted to communicate foremost is that Emigre is not dead. We haven't closed our doors. We discontinued our magazine but we are moving on with all our other activities and added some others. Come check out my exhibition of new photographs at Gallery 16 in San Francisco this Friday. 6-9 pm. It's free.

On Jan.09.2006 at 11:28 PM
Chris Gee’s comment is:

Actually, one could argue that the main reason why blogs have become so popular is not the instantaneous responses, the open public dialog, the open source ideology (although those are its finest attributes). No, the reason why they have become so popular is because they are free. I'd be really curious to know how many people would visit SpeakUp if they had to pay for it. So as long as Armin is willing to pay the fees and do the all the heavy lifting, all others can boast about this terrific "public" medium.

FWIW, broadcast TV and radio are free too (at least for the listeners).

Blogs are very much still in their infancy as a publication medium. I would imagine that in the early days of periodicals and the free printed press, most -- if not all -- of the publications were distributed for free.

Technological advances typically occur faster than their eventual business models. 10 years from now we'll be remembering the "good old days" when all blogs were free.

.chris{}

On Jan.10.2006 at 12:49 AM